Needing Eden

by Deana Chadwell5/4/17
All of us – liberal or conservative, Muslim or Christian, black or white – are homesick. Deep inside all of us lurks a longing for something, someplace so lost in the past that we can no longer name it. I contend that we compose music in minor keys, stage tragedies, and write mournful poetry just to express this. For anyone who stops in the midst of this hectic life to think, to actually feel, knows what I’m talking about – it feels like missing someone terribly, but not remembering who.

We all deal with this lost-ness differently. Some of us drink or do drugs. Some of us hide in frantic sex or work or social involvement. We play endless computer games, read mystery novels, watch hours and hours of bad TV. We grasp for wealth and power. We go shopping, we gamble, we go bungee-jumping and cover the longing with an adrenaline surge. Some us figure it out and grope our way back to God. What we’re missing is Eden and our evening walks with Him.

One of the great sicknesses of our time is our insistence that we can recreate Eden and do it on our own terms. We have assumed that our unhappiness crawled out of a badly designed social structure – one that has allowed some to get ahead while others go without, one that falls short of paradise. Perhaps we misinterpret our longings and think the emptiness can be filled with things – if only we had some of the money the rich have too much of.

We have assumed that our unhappiness crawled out of a badly designed social structure – one that has allowed some to get ahead while others go without, one that falls short of paradise. 

This resentment toward the rich is understandable if you go back to, say, medieval times when wealth came when one sucked up to the local royalty enough that he shared with you whatever wealth he’d stolen from someone else. A man who buckled on his armor and rode off to war with his king was banking on the king’s gratitude after the battle. The rich back then didn’t get rich by inventing something useful, manufacturing something everyone wanted, by making life safer, less painful, or more fun for everyone.

I recently watched a documentary on one of the old manor houses in England and I was struck by some statistics. The owner of the manor (bequeathed to him by some king) often entertained a hundred people for dinner. One of the most admired dishes at these dinners was turtle soup. It took one turtle per guest and each turtle cost 20 pounds sterling – the average yearly wage for the servants serving this exorbitant meal. Under those circumstances I can understand the bitterness that could take root in a person’s soul.

I listened to a woman – a professor (of Marxism 101, I assume) trying to explain how right and true and good it would be to tax the rich (which did not include her, she assured the host) at 80%. She just assumed that they had no right to that money, no more right than the nobles of the 11th century, and that everyone would live happily ever after if the rich were poorer. If she can’t think any more clearly than that, she doesn’t deserve her professorial position.

But this is the 21st century, a thousand years after the turtle soup, and now any person who can muster the determination and the self-discipline to make something of himself can, theoretically, do so. No one is locked into a feudal system, or a rigid caste arrangement; deep-seated resentment is misplaced and sounds silly, like a 5-year-old complaining that his brother got more ice cream.

But in all fairness to the professor, she was just wanting Eden. She doesn’t understand that, in a sense, it’s gone – the cherubim are stationed at the gate and we can’t get back in. Every human being since Eden has something wrong inside him. We’re all broken, from the get-go; no matter what our physical, mental, or social standing — we’re broken.

However, God did provide the information we need to produce a society that will provide the best possible organization, considering our fractured condition.  Any society made of human beings is one built with crooked bricks and that takes expert engineering. The bricks can’t do it themselves.

The closest mankind has ever come to building a viable social order is recorded in the Constitution of the United States. That document recognizes the brokenness of man, his tendency to aggregate power, and it took the laws of God – the design of the Chief Engineer – into account. It has worked well – not flawlessly, but well for over 200 years.

But here we are faced with a generation of Americans who are trying to assuage their longing for the Garden by denying that we ever left it, by denying the God that created that Garden, by thinking they can make their own Eden.

And look what it’s taking to do it:

  1. Government so vast, so wealthy, so powerful that we no longer have a clear idea of where the power is even located. Is it in the bureaucracy? The press? The courts? It certainly doesn’t seem to be in the legislature or the presidency anymore.
  2. Schools dedicated to indoctrination instead of education, where speech is tightly controlled, ideas other than the DIY Eden-approved memes are prohibited, and where self-discipline and decency are no longer required.
  3. Taxation that limits all of our activities; taxation that is intended not only to raise revenue but, more importantly, to control our daily activities; taxation that robs us of our incentive.
  4. Division. The fact is that you can’t organize individuals nearly as easily as you can groups, and if you can pit the groups against each other you can distract them from the truth of their unique individuality. The only group that is not easy to herd is the family and therefore the family also has to be eliminated and to do that sexuality has to be shaken loose from its moorings, allowed and encouraged to run amuck ruining children, killing babies, and, as an added bonus, the destruction of the Christian church. Our previous administration accomplished a great deal in this area. The much-lauded “diversity” is a celebration of just that – the fracturing of a previously stable society.
  5. Heavy doses of guilt, of angst, of hopelessness, because angry, unhappy people are also easy to manipulate. No sense of purpose can be allowed to flourish.
  6. Language manipulation. For one thing, if you change meanings often enough, no one knows what anyone is talking about so political prestidigitation is easier. For another, it’s easier to control people’s thinking if you control their language.

You see, Eden was a place of free will – to eat or not to eat; that was the question – the only question. But man didn’t choose well, so those trying to mickey-mouse a new Eden know not to include free will. In Brave New World, Huxley kept his population so giddy with Soma, sex, and entertainment that most didn’t realize that they’d lost that all-important attribute of being human. Orwell’s Big Brother didn’t allow any options, either, and in Shangri-La, Conway could do a lot of choosing, except for one decision – the choice of leaving. The place was perfect, but it was a prison nevertheless.

The much-lauded “diversity” is a celebration of just that – the fracturing of a previously stable society.

The world is littered with dead and dying utopian dreams. Man has been trying since Babel to recreate that first perfect garden. Sir Thomas More wrote out his utopian plan in the 15th century. The Pilgrims tried to rewrite society’s rules that first awful winter in Plymouth. Joseph Stalin, Adolf Hitler, Mao, now Maduro and Kim Jong-un all have tried to make perfection out of evil. But it can’t be done. Not on human terms. We have to wait for God to come do it for us – and He will. Until then we will continue needing Eden.


Deana Chadwell blogs at ASingleWindow.com. She is also an adjunct professor at Pacific Bible College in southern Oregon. She teaches writing and public speaking.
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Deana Chadwell

About Deana Chadwell

I have spent my life teaching young people how to read and write and appreciate the wonder of words. I have worked with high school students and currently teach writing at Pacific Bible College in southern Oregon. I have spent more than forty years studying the Bible, theology, and apologetics and that finds its way into my writing whether I'm blogging about my experiences or my opinions. I have two and a half moldering novels, stacks of essays, hundreds of poems, some which have won state and national prizes. All that writing -- and more keeps popping up -- needs a home with a big plate glass window; it needs air; it needs a conversation. I am also an artist who works with cloth, yarn, beads, gourds, polymer clay, paint, and photography. And I make soap.
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114 Responses to Needing Eden

  1. Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

    We all deal with this lost-ness differently. Some of us drink or do drugs. Some of us hide in frantic sex or work or social involvement. We play endless computer games, read mystery novels, watch hours and hours of bad TV. We grasp for wealth and power. We go shopping, we gamble, we go bungee-jumping and cover the longing with an adrenaline surge. Some us figure it out and grope our way back to God. What we’re missing is Eden and our evening walks with Him.

    You forgot tattoos, but I’ll let it slide this time.

  2. Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

    This is one of your better essays, Deana. A coherent theme runs throughout rather than a scattershot of analysis. I think point 5 and 6 are profound. I especially like #5:

    Heavy doses of guilt, of angst, of hopelessness, because angry, unhappy people are also easy to manipulate. No sense of purpose can be allowed to flourish.

    There is a central premise to this essay that is in direct and definable opposition to the “I’m unhappy because society isn’t perfectly ordered, aka a “badly designed social structure.”

    Most people today, and I think very many Christians, aren’t going to buy your argument. But it is an argument that is clear. One may or may not accept the central premise, but it is a clear premise and one necessarily and logically set as an alternative to nihilism.

    The way the premise of Utopia is maintained for many is a belief in evolution in the deepest meaning of the word. Given how much technology and political systems have changed in only the last 300 years, one can be excused to some extent for believing that the trajectory of human happiness is permanently set onward and upward. Darwinism has also shifted people’s minds to the idea that improvement is a natural and blind goal of the universe.

    Those with eyes to see can appreciate modern conveniences and medicines while noting how angst-filled and unhappy most people are despite having the material abundance that a king of not long ago would have envied. Onward and upward our technology goes but the human heart stays mired in troubles…troubles doubled by expectations of always the easy life (with the modern twist of “that someone else pays for”).

    We are here. Something obviously created us and the universe. That something is so rich in power and being that we are literally chips off the old block and necessarily broken in terms of not being Gods (Obama, Hillary, and Trump notwithstanding). Whether the expulsion from the Garden of Eden is a metaphor or an actual event, I think it is self-evidently true that if “randomness” and “evolution” are one’s paradigm (inhaled briskly with materialism and de-facto atheism) one will be of a pampered and unhappy attitude like the Princess in “The Princess and the Pea” for whom even several levels of soft mattress were an intolerable pain because of one pea placed at the very bottom level.

    You can never fill yourself up with the strictly material. And had Deana wrote longer, or wrote a sequel article, she might have articulated the many pseudo-religious aspects of Utopianism (including environmentalism, the Church of Global Warming, etc.). People are trying to bolt-on a transcendent purpose through mere social means. The “missing Eden” lurks inside like itching powder, even more so when the attempt to scratch is so far off base.

    • You are dead right about the part evolutionary thinking plays in all this. In the first place, it cuts us loose from our moorings and once adrift it plays the part of the Greek sirens, luring us ever deeper into open and hopeless waters. Without Darwinian assumptions, utopian thinking can have no substance, but if apes can become human…..

      Love the “itching powder” analogy. So true.

      • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

        I should go back and read Huxley’s “Brave New World.” In that world, people were specifically bred to fill special roles in society (a sort of Indian caste system run “benevolently” by the government).

        I bring this subject up because among yutes, anchored in the idea of evolution (where monkeys can indeed become humans, given enough time, and socialist ideas can work out if given enough time), are trending to the belief in “transhumanism” which is “the belief or theory that the human race can evolve beyond its current physical and mental limitations, especially by means of science and technology.” This goes hand-in-hand with the idea that machines will eventually be able to think as we do and will either be able to be made better than us (so we might even be able to use them to enhance ourselves) or will make themselves better (given enough time, of course) with no end of perfectibility in sight.

        One can inflate this to say “Men wish to become gods,” and I think a certain percentage do. But I think much of what drives this is escapism. I suppose that is the inherent nature of Utopianism itself.

        In our society, as Rush Limbaugh has amply explained many times, starting from the cradle you are taught that you, as a human being, are a pest on this world. You, or your race, is responsible for vast social-justice crimes, environmental crimes, homophobic crimes, Islamophobic crimes, gender crimes, etc. By the time you’ve been thoroughly indoctrinated, what’s to like? Who wouldn’t want to escape all that? And, of course, the useful product for revolutionary politicians is that any defense of that-which-has-come-before is de-legitimized.

        I see this with a family member who has recently gotten into a bunch of Native American junk having first dispensed with his Christian faith. He told me the other day that he no longer thought he could celebrate the 4th of July.

        I shouldn’t get any more personal than that or I’ll get in trouble. 🙂 But this brought home to me the basic fact that we’ve become a bunch of ninnies, always in search of emotional satisfaction, always amenable to the next Snake Oil that someone is selling. I tried to tell him that the current “Native American” culture was a gigantic Marxist lie and one based on victimhood. At the last rally against a pipeline, for example, the Native Americans and others trashed the place and the Park Service apparently had to spend over a million dollars to clean up after these “compassionate” people who are one with nature.

        Not that American Indians don’t have a historic beef. They do. But only a fool can’t recognize that the “beef” they have today is just more of the trained-seal victimhood schtick of the “social justice warriors.”

        And if I had one point to make that ties this all together it would be this: We Westerners have become alienated from our heritage and thus will not defend it. We have become emotional escapists. We cannot sit down and deal with any notion but perfection. And certainly our heritage is less than perfect. It is the nature of reality. But it is this very heritage that has given us so many blessings. Instead, the demonic Marxists (and I don’t doubt a possible influence of Satan) have turned the good into the bad and the bad into the good. Always the promise is that we can transcend our limitations and be financially and emotionally satisfied if only we will join the club of social justice reality-avoiders.

        I’d like to improve reality, and my reality, as well. There are several areas in which I would like to “evolve” a bit. But this doesn’t happen by magic. It takes planning and work. If the main driving force is therapeutic, what will that make of me or make of anyone? And we have to make choices. We can’t have it all. We are not god. And despite the promises of Big Government and Social Justice Warriors, we shall not transcend our inherent human state anytime soon.

        • Timothy Lane says:

          I’m not sure how much blame the Indians deserve for the trash left behind by the enviro-zealots (who provided a reminder that liberals conveniently judge people on their views, not their behavior). According to articles I read during the stand-off, they wanted the outsiders gone because of all the trash.

          • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

            Well, research the matter, if you will, and get back to us.

            My favorite incident of White Guilt based on fraud is that old commercial of the “American Indian” crying as he stands by the side of the road covered in trash. That “Indian” (Iron Eyes Cody) was actually an Italian (Sicilian). And myths are born. Religions are born.

            And, by the way, I can’t see that the “environmentally sensitive” generations brought up on this stuff have done anything themselves to reduce throwing trash out of car windows. I have never ever done that outside of an apple core on a country road. So what is the point of these commercials and all this environmental indoctrination if it doesn’t actually lead people to better habits?

            • Timothy Lane says:

              I don’t think I’d heard that it was a fake Indian, but it was a fake tear. And of course the writers of the ad wouldn’t want to live like an Indian of 2 centuries ago. Nor would they want to take their chances of reducing our population to their level. That’s why the Indians did so much less harm to the environment.

              • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

                I love the story I read of Indians, exuberant to share their wonders with some set of pioneers, set ablaze one of the pitch-laden trees…possibly a pine, I don’t know. They fought other tribes constantly. They set fire to the precious forests to clear land for their game. All in all, they were people not that much different from us. It’s just that they had Stone Age tools and cultures and thus couldn’t have that much impact. But apparently one reason some of the tribes wore nomadic is because they’d trash one place and then move on when the garbage had piled up too much and the stench was too bad.

              • Timothy Lane says:

                I understand that the Plains Indians were increasingly prodigal with the buffalo as they acquired horses and guns. Instead of eating the whole animal, they could kill enough of them that they would just eat their choicer parts, such as the tongue.

              • Kung Fu Zu Kung Fu Zu says:

                The slash-and-burn agricultural method has been used for millennia and has destroyed tens of millions of acres of forest land around the world.

                It is still used today in many parts of the world. This is a well known fact which can easily be confirmed. In Brazil and Indonesia alone millions of acres of tropical jungle has been burnt down, and not just to make way for palm oil plantations. The smoke would sometimes get so bad that it could be noticed in Singapore, hundreds (sometimes over a thousand) of miles away.

                One cannot help but have contempt for those sensitive souls who, ala Rousseau, believe in the fairy-tale Red-Man of the pre-Columbian era.

                These tribes fought each other on a regular basis, and could be as vicious as one would expect from a barbarian people. They often made a fetish of torturing their victims. I will not go into detail on the gentle way the Aztecs treated prisoners.

                The bad luck of these barbarians was that they were stone-age “civilizations” which encountered a civilization which was modern and several thousand years ahead of theirs technologically.

                When they then proceeded to practice their barbarity upon these newcomers who did not live in awe of vicious primitives and took a dim view of them killing and torturing women and children they reaped a whirl-wind which they could never have expected.

                And by the way, from almost the moment Europeans landed in the Americas, some of the indigenous peoples were happy to ally themselves with the Europeans to fight their hated native enemies.

                Sadly, such is the way of the world.

              • Timothy Lane says:

                A number of social scientists have estimated that violence, on a per capita basis, is far worse in small, primitive villages than in modern cities. If you have a village of 100 people and average a murder every 5 years, that’s the equivalent of 600,000 murders a year in the United States, or 6000 a year in the city of Chicago. And that doesn’t even add in the tribal wars.

  3. Lucia says:

    Our youngest daughter gets dreamy eyed when she speaks of the utopia of globalism. Not only does that dismay me and sets me to praying for her, it also saddens me. She’s in for a deep disappointment when she discovers, as Deana writes, utopia has no room for the fallen nature of mankind and murders millions of “misfits.” The only governmental system that takes into account our imperfections has been ours and that’s why it’s worth fighting for.

    • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

      I wonder what your daughter means by “globalism”? Is it the belief that science and good (and big) government can fix all ills?

      One online dictionary definition of globalism is:

      the attitude or policy of placing the interests of the entire world above those of individual nations.

      Another is:

      to advocate for such policies as increases in immigration, free trade, lowering tariffs, interventionism and global governance.

      Another is:

      the idea that events in one country cannot be separated from those in another and that economic and foreign policy should be planned in an international way

      I would say from the kumbaya perspective, “globalism” means that you state that you care for everyone. In practice, I think this means “Please, cold, mean, world…care for me!”

      The socialist mentality hides a tiger behind the sheep. The tiger plays the sheep. But the tiger believes that he or she will be a net beneficiary of their stated compassion…which always derives from taking from one group to give to another. This means is justifed with all kinds of pretty sounding political nostrums: “diversity,” “equality,” “social justice,” etc.

      What we don’t tend to see from the kumbaya types is anything but self-inflating rhetoric. When they go to events to protest a supposed environmental disaster, they leave behind a disaster of trash. They may say they have great compassion for “the poor” or illegal aliens, but few are inviting them in to live with them. Such elements remain but mascots to be used to show the world one’s supposed compassion.

      Am I being too cynical? It’s possible. I have no problem with people hoping for a better world. But what we’re talking about there among the typical yute is simply a sort of narcissistic cult of utopia. It is their own needs they feel are not being met. They are one of the most selfish generations we have ever created and they mask it by their supposed compassion for the world. And if they were materially doing things to make the world better other than Tweeting angry tweets or getting together in mass mobs holding angry banners, I might believe that it wasn’t all about them. We need people willing to roll up their sleeves and to try to make the world a better place. But that doesn’t happen via the equivalent of Tweets.

      • Timothy Lane says:

        That sounds like a reasonable description of globalism. John Ringo in some of his works refers to it as “transnationalism”, and like most conservatives (as opposed to Republican Beltway Bandits and their ilk) opposes it strongly. In practice, it means sacrificing your fellow countrymen to foreigners. And those who support it do expect to benefit from it themselves, as you say.

        • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

          No doubt “globalism” is one of the redemptive acts that can free us from our crime of being prosperous Americans. It took me a while to understand why anyone would think a flood of third-world illegals into this country would be a good thing. But it’s not about it being a good thing or bad thing. For the lower-tier useful idiots it is about redemption for supposed past crimes. America can only ever redeem herself in the eyes of the Left, and social justice warriors of all stripes, if she will decrease herself.

          This is the core of the foul religion of Leftism. “Utopia” is a requirement for it is the only alternative remaining when tried-and-true ideas and practices have been demonized and dispensed with. Socialism *must* be right because of the crimes of capitalism, etc. They are left with forever punching-against and demonizing that which has become before them and never actually having to prove their own theories. They promise steady improvement leading to perfection where no one ever have to make hard choices or be limited.

          Life offers us only choices. What socialism is in its modern form is an escape from adult responsibilities and the requirement to make choices (and ultimately, then, the freedom to do so). Can anyone seriously look out at our current culture and say that it is intellectual, classy, uplifting, and noble? It is instead a graffiti stew of juvenile-grade vulgarism and stupidity.

  4. Timothy Lane says:

    Very good, detailed analysis here. There are a few points I want to make about medieval wealth, at least in England. The nobility got most of their wealth from farming their vast holdings (of course, they didn’t do the work themselves). Royal office could also supply wealth, both licit and illicit. Looting in war sometimes brought a lot, but I suspect most of it disappeared quickly enough (much of it went to the soldiers who did the looting). And keeping a knight’s arms, armor, and horses was expensive.

    One might also note that there were merchants who got wealthy through trade. The de la Pole family, who became Dukes of Suffolk, got started as wool merchants. They did earn their wealth, and were often richer than the nobility. (This is why there were sumptuary laws, so that they couldn’t masquerade as aristocrats.)

    And in the late 1300s, we began to see leveling movements, such as John Ball’s rebellious church activities. “When Adam delved and Even span, who was then the gentleman?”

    • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

      One of the interesting aspects of reading some of the biographies of St. Francis is that it was exactly in his day, in Italy, when the modern merchant class (aka “middle class”) was developing. In our day, exactly as Deana wrote, “now any person who can muster the determination and the self-discipline to make something of himself can, theoretically, do so.” That wasn’t always the case but it is now.

      The degradation of poverty should not be underrated. But there is a big difference when it is imposed from above and when it is self-imposed. And sometimes that line is blurred.

      When you have a culture and a government handing out “free stuff,” hooking people into generational welfare dependency, telling them that white Christian straight people are to blame for their troubles, that our wounds can be healed by taking from “the rich,” telling them that they are precious snowflakes and nothing is ever their fault, you can certainly create a poverty of the spirit which then leads to material poverty. You can create a Detroit, either as a bad place to live or a Detroit in your mind.

      Where we find ourselves today is a society built upon lies. We hear every day that someone else is responsible for creating “fake news” when it is usually those announcing the culprit who are the originators of the fake news itself. Or both sides are fake. We have Trump and the GOP Congress celebrating the repeal of Obamacare when, according to Mark Levin, at best 10% is repealed while the main socialistic assumptions of universal health care are further entrenched by the GOP and Trump.

      We have an entire society for whom truth is simply spouting whatever outraged emotion they have been trained, like a circus seal, to emote on cue.

      With society being so large, with so many specialized fields, with just so much happening at any one time, the individual is in a very poor position to know what is going on. We therefore must rely on other experts and specialists. Our freedom-based society where any person can grow up to be president (or at least be president of his own company) requires at least a semi-literate populace in regards to what is going on.

      But what we have now is corruption of these experts and specialists, especially including our president whom George Will aptly describes thusly:

      It is urgent for Americans to think and speak clearly about Donald Trump’s inability to do either. This seems to be not a mere disinclination but a disability. It is not merely the result of intellectual sloth but of an untrained mind bereft of information and married to stratospheric self-confidence . . . His fathomless lack of interest in America’s path to the present and his limitless gullibility leave him susceptible to being blown about by gusts of factoids that cling like lint to a disorderly mind.

      It used to be the job of a proper Western education to create a mind ordered with facts and rich with useful and relevant philosophy. The daily news cycle, in fact the whole education establishment itself, has become a means to institute confusion. And we see this reflected in our politics (whether talking Hillary or Trump) where incompetency is hailed as something other than what it is.

      I certainly strongly agree with Deana when she wrote, “Language manipulation. For one thing, if you change meanings often enough, no one knows what anyone is talking about so political prestidigitation is easier. For another, it’s easier to control people’s thinking if you control their language.”

      What means anything if anything can mean anything? That’s where we are now. Good luck picking your way through the mass confusion.

  5. Rosalys says:

    Deana, I had to look up prestidigitation, and found it means, “magic tricks performed as entertainment.” That’s perfect, because as far as the Our Keepers are concerned, it’s all smoke and mirrors to keep us off balance, confused, and unsure of where the danger is coming from. They create problems and then swoop in with miraculous solutions, which somehow make matters worse, so more solutions (which they conveniently produce from behind your ear) are forthcoming, etc., etc., etc., ad infinitum. (Quite Machiavellian – http://campaign.r20.constantcontact.com/render?m=1108762609255&ca=2e7eaffc-74fd-4619-9835-5e18ab3b7438 )

    But these paradise seekers truly are looking for a better world. There are the generous Utopians who just want a better world for all. Unfortunately this sometimes means that some collateral damage, in the form of liquidating certain uncooperative elements (i.e., me and you,) may be necessary. And of course there are the selfish Utopians, for whom Eden means, they get to have all the stuff, the babes, and slaves to order around and tell what to do. What they all have in common is the pride of Lucifer (sin,) and their results are always the same – bloodshed, wreckage, and ultimately, hell.

    Christ provides the only way of escape from a paradise lost. It does requires one to give up pulling up their on bootstraps. Most folks don’t want to do that. They want to sing along with Frank and, “Do it my way!”

    Sorry, Brad. I know you’re a big Sinatra fan, but I’ve always hated that song.

    • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

      Sorry, Brad. I know you’re a big Sinatra fan, but I’ve always hated that song.

      Yikes! No dissing Frank. I’m afraid I’m taking the gloves off. (And give me a break, Mr. Kung. It was the first take.)

      And now, Rosalys dear
      Egg on your face, Blue Eyes you’re hurtin’
      My stubborn friend, I’ll say it here
      I’ll defend Frank, you may be certain

      He’s great, and that’s no bull.
      I’ve played each and every album
      And more, more more than this, he’s an Italian

      • Kung Fu Zu Kung Fu Zu says:

        And a cappella, no less. Bravo, bravisimo. I have always maintained, everyone can sing. It only takes the will to find the joy in doing so.

        • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

          You’re too kind, Mr. Kung. I could use voice lessons. More importantly, I could use comedy lessons. Hopefully that made you laugh. 😀 I did it my way. And, well, we’ve all seen this culture full of “my way” stuff that is just horrendous. Perhaps I should have tried to do it Frank’s way. But very few could.

      • Rosalys says:

        “…he’s an Italian”

        …with Mafia connections.

        I knew them was fighting’ words when I wrote them! I’m not saying he didn’t have a beautiful voice, and I’m not dissing his entire repertoire. I just don’t like that one song, because I don’t like words. Unfortunately, the words speak too much truth. Too often I am doing it my way, and as a Christian, I should be doing it my Savior’s way. For the same reason, I don’t like “I Gotta Be Me” though I like Sammy Davis, Jr.

        “And more, more more than this…”

        I think it should be, “And more, much more than this…” For shame, you old Frankaphile, you!

        • Rosalys says:

          Okay. I listened and you got it right in the singing.

          • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

            Yes. Much rather than more. More more was not needed. Less more. Frank wasn’t perfect either.

        • Timothy Lane says:

          I must admit I don’t particularly like “My Way” either, though I don’t think I dislike it as you do. Of course, having grown up when I did, my favorite songs of his tend to be 60s songs such as “Strangers in the Night” and “It Was a Very Good Year”.

          • Timothy Lane says:

            Going through my MP3 files just now, I was reminded that although I’m no fan of “My Way”, I do enjoy the theme song of Laverne and Shirley, which has much the same message. (“We’re gonna make our dreams come true, doing it our way.”) I think it has to do with differences in rhythm and such.

        • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

          I’m a fan of Young Frank more than Old Frank (although I’m partial to his 1947 version).

          Sinatra is a complicated character and I don’t defend his life, just his singing, although eventually he became a great friend and supporter of Ronald Reagan.

          Speaking of Eden, Alexander Desanctis has an interesting article titled The True Goal of Feminism.

          Though much of the book is confused and confusing, it has one clear fatal flaw. Filipovic never once considers that perhaps the pain she depicts has in fact been caused by sexual autonomy, spiraling out of control in the wake of the Sexual Revolution, when feminists made consequence-free pleasure the pinnacle of their quest. It’s impossible to deny that they’ve achieved most of their policy goals, but the results don’t appear as rosy as they hoped, and the answer, according to Filipovic, is not to question the value of autonomy but to demand more.

          The result is a culture of “me,” ignoring that real happiness isn’t found in pursuit of self but in pursuit of the good of others. Filipovic casually dismisses as misogynistic both the value of sacrifice and the eudaimonic tradition, a Greek school of thought that understood happiness as authentic human flourishing, found by pursuing virtue in accord with human nature.

          In contrast to this conception, pleasure is always fleeting and sends us scurrying from one diversion to the next as momentary gratification fades, distracting us from the fact that the constant chase leaves us unfulfilled. Flourishing requires accountability for our choices, as well as accepting that suffering is unavoidable and can lead to growth in character and in the ability to love.

          So, you’re all thinking. What did Sinatra say about all this?

          My story is much too sad to be told,
          But practically everything leaves me totally cold.
          The exception I know is the case
          When I’m out on a quiet spree,
          Fighting vainly the old ennui,
          And I suddenly turn and see your fabulous face.

          I get no kick from champagne.
          Mere alcohol doesn’t thrill me at all.
          So tell me why should it be true
          That I get a kick out of you?

          He may have been talking about Jesus, but I’m pretty sure he was talking about dames. Still…there is some notion there that mere material pleasures are secondary to human relationships. Or cigarette smoke. I’m not sure.

          • Timothy Lane says:

            Note that in addition to his personal indulgences and such, he was certainly involved in patriotic movies — Von Ryan’s Express, for example, and for that matter The Manchurian Candidate. (There’s the very nice scene at the end in which he reads off a list of the deeds for which various people qualified for the Congressional Medal of Honor.)

            • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

              Frank was a fully-alive hedonist and egoist. That’s not exactly rare for those who make big successes of themselves in the entertainment business or politics. You wouldn’t expect to find his kind in a monastery, so you sort of have to judge accordingly.

              Frank was probably a very needy person. It is said that he hated being alone and would always surround himself with people. And he was the alpha male of alpha males, inheriting the center of Hollywood style and “with-it-ness” from Bogart. You didn’t say no to Frank…not if you wanted to be part of his inner circle or even his outer circle. Or his outer outer circle.

              He could be called a man who certainly died with the most “stuff.” But he was a good man in many ways. But he lived in a universe so different from the one you and I inhabit, it’s like trying to judge what is appropriate for a dolphin. That he remained anchored into more-or-less a good sense of Americanism and didn’t run off half-cocked in Progressivism was certainly to his credit.

              • Timothy Lane says:

                A good indication of his treatment of others can be seen in his handling of Peter Lawford as reported in O’Reilly’s Killing Kennedy. Lawford was accepted as part of the Rat Pack due to his Kennedy connection — until Sinatra and Kennedy fell out over the former’s mob ties. Then he had no particular use for Lawford anymore.

              • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

                Certainly Lawford (who set up affairs for both Sinatra and Kennedy) caught the blame for RFK’s objection to this brother about the mob ties which put the kibosh on the Kennedy visit to Frank’s house…even after Frank had gone to the trouble of remodeling his home, complete with a helipad. This is what touched off the split.

                But in the case of Lawford I think it’s a case of lying down with dogs and getting fleas. But it was, from what I gather, no way his fault. But Frank had to take it out on someone.

  6. Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

    I was reading the comments to this article posted over at American Thinker and the discussion thus far is mostly about free will.

    But one poster makes an attempt to address the subject at hand and makes some interesting points.

    There’s another interesting (and quite logical) comment by rredhawk:

    People definitely miss “the Garden”. I never understood people I know who are into vegetarianism and nudism until I learned that prior to the fall of man and the great deluge people, by nature (God’s original plan), ate only plants and wore not clothes. I think most nudists/vegans are at least subconsciously trying to “get back” to that original and far more benevolent lifestyle/situation that exited in the original Garden of Eden.

    I don’t think nudism is driven by a desire to get back to Eden. It seems like people are trying more to get back to Haight-Ashbury. But I could be wrong. Maybe Adam and Even were libtards.

    As for the discussion on free will, I sometimes wonder if people actually read these artciles. They just seem to jump to their own chattering shtick. Might there be more to the world than the material? Might we be involved in material excess as a substitute for other, deeper yearnings? It’s a good topic but perhaps requires too much uncomfortable introspection for some.

    • Timothy Lane says:

      I can see the link between nudism and the garden in Eden, though I imagine few nudists are thinking in those terms. (How many would even be aware of them today?) But vegetarianism? I don’t know that the Bible discussed what Adam and Eve ate — other than the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, which is what got them in trouble. Unless one wants to argue that Cain’s sacrifice was rejected because he was an animal herder — but so were many of the patriarchs and other Biblical heroes (such as David), so that seems doubtful.

      • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

        To me being nude means sex….or taking a shower.

        In the past, I’ve encountered articles intersecting on nudism (perhaps reporting some strange occurrence…I by no means have made a study of nudism) and then read the comments by readers at bottom of the article. Yikes. These people just give me the creeps. In one sense, I guess you can normalize anything. Do people in the Vatican feel strange because they’re all walking around in silly hats? Do Civil War re-enactors think of themselves as weird because they’re all dressed up in period uniforms?

        Still, it’s not the nudism, per se, I find strange. It’s the rationalizations for it. “I’m just not ashamed of my body like everyone else.” (Well, perhaps some should be.) “This is the way we are meant to be.” “Nudism has nothing to do with sex.” (Truthfully, if I was at a nude beach I would pull up a lawn chair, crack a few cold ones, and break out my best pair of binoculars.)

        And although nudism in some form (the Greeks apparently wrestled nude) has probably always been around, it still seems a strange thing to me. It seems completely and irrevocably involved in creepy-cultism.

        Dennis Prager notes (if I remember correctly, and surely Pat will correct me) that this naturism stuff is a direct offshoot of Marxist materialism and Darwinism wherein there is no such thing as human exceptionalism and we are all merely animals. Prager’s point is that we cloth ourselves for reasons other than just staying warm. We do so because we are not animals. And I think people today unclothe themselves as a modern rite-of-passage to show that they are modern and not hung up on sex, etc., thus the nude bike rides and such that pop up (no pun intended) all over.

        Still, compared to Islamic beaches (if they have beaches), a normal clothed (to the extent anyone is) America beach is almost a nude beach. So I guess you have to write this off as “to each his own.” And I love the clothing-free natives depicted in 1984’s The Bounty with Mel Gibson.

        And it must be pointed out that a very powerful and pervasive theme in Progressive culture is that places such as the various topless Pacific islands are considered pristine and unspoiled, not yet driven to shame by Christian notions of nakedness being bad. In this understanding, the unspoiled people in Eden of course were naked (and, really, perhaps they have a point).

        But as least with the Pacific Islanders, I think there never were as “one with nature” peaceful sexual utopia that the wishful-thinking anthropologists wanted to see (likely one of the early instances of widespread pseudo-science).

        Be that as it may, there’s probably a happy medium in all this (and it looks like this). Almost inseparable is the idea of paradise (or utopia) being a sexual paradise. Man (particularly men) can usually imagine no other. And, well, there could be a worse version of Eden I suppose.

        • Timothy Lane says:

          The Bounty is probably the most accurate re-telling of the story of the mutiny. It’s another excellent example of a historical movie. Most versions grossly exaggerate the evils of Captain Bligh, who was not in fact an especially severe captain — indeed, his main problem seems to have been inconsistent treatment of his men. The movie is based on Richard Hough’s history of the event, Captain Bligh and Mr. Christian.

          You might find interesting Sharyn McCrumb’s Highland Laddie Gone, a murder mystery set at a Highland Scots event. There are some nice interactions between the main character, Elizabeth Macpherson (who appears in several McCrumb novels) and the local sheriff. In one, she apprises him that he’s descended from Flora MacDonald — and he has no idea of how significant that is to a bunch of Scots fanciers. Later he’s telling here that their grounds will be the site of a SCA event the next weekend, and they — “the Clan Chattan Lady of the Cat” and a Confederate colonel in Civil War re-enactments — agree that the SCA people (who go around in medieval costume) are crazy.

          • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

            Yes, Captain Bligh comes out looking much better in this one. Mel Gibson is just a bit too sensitive and unstrung (and he plays this very very well). Bligh is firm but he did after all let his crew carouse with the nekked women. But enough was enough. His crew was beginning to mutiny as well as going native. Christian comes off as a love-sick teenager having a temper tantrum.

            It’s a very fine movie, gripping from start to finish.

            Here’s a Kindle version of Highland Laddie Gone. It sounds like it might be right up my alley. Someone describes it as “lightweight and humorous.”

            Funny you found a reference to Civil War re-enactment and crazy.

            • Timothy Lane says:

              Well, it isn’t my phrasing, and probably not McCrumb’s personal opinion. (In a later book, she had a female re-enactor named Amy Powell Hill, descendant of the Confederate general, who pointed out that physically she was actually closer to the size of a typical War of the Rebellion soldier than most male re-enactors and was portrayed very sympathetically). She was making a point about people playing odd roles .

              Incidentally, once Elizabeth and I visited the Patton Museum at Fort Knox (they had a nice exhibit on Elvis Presley, who always had a due regard for our men in uniform after his own stint in the service). On the way back, we stopped at a little re-enactment at a local fort of a hypothetical Confederate attack on Louisville. That was fun — but also rather noisy.

        • Steve Lancaster says:

          Ok, in the South if you don’t have clothes on your nude. If your nekked your up to no good.

        • pst4usa says:

          No correction required, Brad. You got that one right on the money.

        • Kung Fu Zu Kung Fu Zu says:

          (Truthfully, if I was at a nude beach I would pull up a lawn chair, crack a few cold ones, and break out my best pair of binoculars.)

          In my world travels, I have come upon a few nude beaches. Some were marked off and others weren’t. It has been my unfortunate experience that most of the denizens of these sun-bleached paradises have bodies which one would avoid peering at through binoculars.

      • Rosalys says:

        Cain grew vegetables. Abel was the shepherd. (Gen. 4:2) Abel’s offering was accepted, because it was a blood offering; the prescribed offering and a foreshadowing of Christ being offered as a sacrifice. Just as the fig leaves didn’t quite cut, neither did Cain’s corn.

        • Timothy Lane says:

          I sit corrected. But that furthers my thesis that there’s no reason to believe the diet in the garden was vegetarian.

          • Kung Fu Zu Kung Fu Zu says:

            I can imagine large slabs of beautifully smoked bacon hanging from trees for Adam’s and Eve’s enjoyment. Add a couple of hens some tomatoes and one has the famous English breakfast.

            From that point of view, being driven out of Eden meant separation from one of the main food groups, a very stern punishment. It took millennia for mankind to rediscover smoked bacon. A great shame since it is well known that everything is better with bacon.

            • Timothy Lane says:

              Well, they could eat unsmoked bacon, though the Israelites would later be forbidden to eat any form of pork (along with many other dietary prohibitions, such as horsemeat and shellfish).

              But if everything goes better with bacon, that would be good news for Shakespeare if Sir Francis had written his works. (Everyone knows it was really the Earl of Oxford. Or maybe Christopher Marlowe.)

          • Gibblet says:

            Hi Timothy, I found the Menu from Eden:

            And God said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit. You shall have them for food. And to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the heavens and to everything that creeps on the earth, everything that has the breath of life, I have given every green plant for food.” And it was so. And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, the sixth day.
            -Genesis 1:29-31 (ESV)

            • Gibblet says:

              Then, after the flood:

              “And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth. The fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth and upon every bird of the heavens, upon everything that creeps on the ground and all the fish of the sea. Into your hand they are delivered. Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. And as I gave you the green plants, I give you everything. But you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood. And for your lifeblood I will require a reckoning: from every beast I will require it and from man. From his fellow man I will require a reckoning for the life of man.”
              -Genesis 9:1-5 (ESV)

            • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

              Basically a PETA-friendly menu (People for Eating Tasty Animals).

              • Gibblet says:

                Sung to the tune of “Don’t Fence Me In”:

                Give me meat, lots of meat. Give me tasty meat to eat.
                Don’t forget the bacon!
                Give me steak, give me ham, heck I’ll even eat a lamb.
                Don’t forget the bacon!
                I want to scarf down a steak about the size of Montana,
                Don’t waste my time with beans or a banana,
                Of Prime Rib Roast I am a big fan, ahhhh….
                Don’t forget the bacon!

              • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

                [Bugs Bunny]Of course you know, this means war.[/Bugs Bunny].

                We’re going to have to involve Frank in this now, Gibblet. I was not going to go nuclear with this meat thing. But you forced my hand:

                Start cleaning the pens, the other white meat
                I want a huge flank part of it, My Pork, My Pork
                That curly-cued tail and flat piggy nose
                Put a skewer through the heart of it, My Pork, My Pork

                I want to sit down to a dinner that doesn’t moo
                And find a meat with some chops, with apple sauce

                These hunger pain cues, are leading my way
                I’ll make a tenderloin of it, My Pork, My Pork
                If I can grill it here, I’ll grill it anywhere
                It’s the best food, My Pork, My Pork!!!

              • Timothy Lane says:

                Sounds good to me, but I’ll happily eat beef, veal, lamb, or chicken as well as pork. We had pork loin last night, as it happens. I remember when I was young we often ate breaded veal cutlets.

    • Rosalys says:

      Adam and Even? Was that intended or an autocorrect? Whatever was intended, I rather like it. It would make a great title for a revenge thriller. Maybe At ’em and Even?

      • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

        Oh my goodness. That’s hilarious. Yes, I have a word processor program that loves getting its own two cents in. I’m hopping Gibblet is out there ready to respond.

        God created heaven and earth
        And all was Adam and Even
        Snakes, apples, and flaming swords
        Before the advent of “even-Steven”

  7. Gibblet says:

    By sneaking in forbidden fruit
    Satan tipped the scales.
    So blood was shed from God’s best
    To cover all our fails

    I edited out my second verse because it could have been better. It is hard to be both theologically sound and poetic on the fly! 🙂

    • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

      Adam and Eve in the garden
      Cold in their birthday suits
      But way hip before their time
      Two swingin’ Genesisian yutes

  8. Gibblet says:

    “These hunger pain cues, are leading my way
    I’ll make a tenderloin of it, My Pork, My Pork
    If I can grill it here, I’ll grill it anywhere
    It’s the best food, My Pork, My Pork!!!”

    Thanks for the laughs Brad!
    This is war, indeed…wake up and smell the bacon.

    • Gibblet says:

      To the tune of “I Am A Rock”:

      A summer’s day
      In my backyard, grillin’ tofu.
      I am alone.

      Then you show up with groceries;
      Rib Steak and Irish Death.
      I’m drooling now,
      I cannot catch my breath!

      You truly rock.
      Bring on the bacon!

      Watch it sizzle!
      Make my steak Medium Rare.
      “Well done” is just a compliment.

      I’ll go get the chilled mugs,
      while you open the beer.
      It sure beats Pepsi;
      I’m so glad you’re here.

      You truly rock.
      Bring on the bacon!

      • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

        You’ve just entered the seventh circle of Paul Simon libtard hell. I’ll respond soon. But first this commercial message:

        [voiceover with a video playing of a backyard BBQ and friends and family sharing a good time]

        When you reach that certain time of day, like many people over the age of 35, you may get abdominal pains. You’ll feel tired, rundown, and in need of some refreshment and nourishment.

        This is the time of your life. Don’t miss out. Ask your butcher about animal flesh for dinner. It’s the food for those with an active lifestyle such as yours.

        [disclaimer]Ask your butcher if animal flesh is right for you. Do not take if you are a PETA member as it may cause you to foam at the mouth. Excessive eating of animal flesh may cause drowsiness. Do not eat large portions of turkey before driving or piloting a plane. If excessive hunger persists after ingestion, talk to your baker about dessert. If under-cooked you could die a horrible death caused by worms.[/disclaimer]

        You’ve lived an active day and now it’s time for dinner. Animal flesh can be a good source of nutrition and backyard fun. Find out more about this nutrition supplement now. Call 1-800-EATBAMBI.

        • Timothy Lane says:

          In 1992, the World SF convention was in Orlando, and I spent a lot of extra time there touristing. I had planned to go to Epcot, but never got there. One restaurant I wanted to visit there included venison, and I naturally thought of it as “Bambiburgers”. (I haven’t had venison since I was a child and my father very occasionally brought some back after hunting.)

          • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

            Do you all think there is some danger that Deana will never post another article here? Look at the direction we’ve taken this. It’s almost as if we conservatives had a good sense of humor. Where’s my safe space again?

            The most outlandish Bambi I’ve ever eaten are Rocky Mountain Oysters. They had the texture of liver with a taste that was arguably not much better. Got them on one of my rare travels in a small local bar near Denver.

            But back to the subject at hand. Clearly the Bible is not a Vegan menu. They may have been naked as libtards at a French Riviera nude beach, but clearly meat was not verboten. Still, there were some rules, arguably only pertaining to the Jews. But eating dogs is bad form. This is so because we have a special working relationship with them. It’s not cannibalism but it’s only one step removed.

            Still, I exist at least partially on the libtard Left in that I think reducing meat in our diet is a good thing. And I think we should kill unborn babies by the truckload, but no fuzzy bunny should ever be made to suffer. Yes, I realize my ideology comes with some conundrums.

            But seriously, one thing I do have toleration for is vegetarianism. If someone can make that work for them, all the better. Animals are not people but they are amazing things and should be treated and used wisely. But I stop short at throwing blood on women wearing furs. But I would dearly love to throw paint at all these idiots with the hideous tattoos. But they’d probably beat me up so I just keep moving on.

            Do you supposed Adam had Eve’s name inside a heart tattooed on his bicep?

            • Gibblet says:

              “Do you all think there is some danger that Deana will never post another article here?”

              Deana must know by now that all ST roads lead to bacon, with some interesting detours to nude beaches and such along the way.

              • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

                All roads lead to bacon. Hahahahaha. So true. Let me give you a multiple choice test in regards to the reasons for wandering far afield at times:

                A) One should sing a good tune while Rome burns.

                B) Prescription pain-killers having gotten really cheap…and it shows.

                C) We are the ones we have been waiting for.

                D) A deep misunderstanding of the significance of the name, Sir Francis Bacon.

                All of the above is not an option. You can, of course, write-in your choice.

              • Timothy Lane says:

                My mother and I used to discuss this very subject, the way conversations tend to wander far afield, decades ago. That’s just how it works out. You never know where a conversation will go from its beginning. On occasion, it even stays on the same subject — but not often.

              • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

                With creative and interesting people, Timothy, the far-afield effect is a positive. Most forums take a dim view off “off topic.” But I don’t. But it can get a little crazy at times. But so long as it’s not dull or boring, all the better.

                I try to give a certain amount of respect to the author and always try to connect back to the source. But often there isn’t enough line to do so effectively. But that’s half the fun.

                That was certainly part of the problem with Eve in the garden. She started making decisions for herself, or at least started making decisions on the basis of other influences. Surely (at least to my mind) eating of the fruit of The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil is a metaphor for having the conscious power to make choices and to aware of the effects of these choices, as well as the motivation for the choices. To be an automaton would be to be an always-obedient servant of God. Never questioning. Never wavering. Never having an original thought in one’s own head. Basically being the kind of dim bulb who thinks Stephen Colbert is a bright fellow.

                And our heads, quite unlike most computers, are made up of a very advanced neural network. Its strength is not in raw computational power and inerrancy but in making fuzzy connections (such as “Trump = Good President”). But I only half jest. The very thing that gives us the power of imagination and creativity can turn back fuzzy on itself and have us believing all kinds of nonsense and making connections that really aren’t there or that are meaningless connections. Aka a bias can blind us by giving inappropriate emphasis on some connections while blinding us from others. Thus I insist, with good reason, that a large problem regarding Leftist indoctrination isn’t just programming people with what dumb things to think. It actually programming people in such a way that they can’t think, aka “lack of critical thinking skills.”

                A sign of intelligence and mental health is a good sense of humor. And creativity itself is an advanced form of intelligence, although one must always have the separate spotlight of reason to shine upon our musings so that we don’t so far far-afield that we drop off the edge of the world or fall entirely out of the Garden of Eden.

              • Rosalys says:

                This is the reason why I like this site so much.

            • Timothy Lane says:

              Back in my FOSFAX days (now we no longer have the energy for it), I once said that a mundane (i.e., not a Fan) was someone who looked up something in the encyclopedia and then put it up. A fan would find other interesting things to look at as well. In this sense, a mundane could be compared to Forrest Gump — who was effective in his way because of that, but still not intelligent.

              On the other hand, when I was on a very hot programming streak, I could ignore distractions like the printer in my room (which was accessed by other programmers as well as me). Some of the other programmers were impressed by that.

        • pst4usa says:

          I called but got no answer! 1-888-EAT-BAMBI? I thought I usually eat the muscle? (except for chicken.)

  9. Gibblet says:

    “reasons for wandering far afield at times”

    E) We toil along this bumpy road between chaos and eternity. It is a pleasure to stop and smell the bacon burgers while I’m stuck in the middle with you (y’all).

  10. pst4usa says:

    F.) Eating bacon might just stop the Islamist from blowing himself up in your presence. They could get contaminated and that would prevent them from getting their 72 Virginians.

    • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

      You score major points on practical, Pal. Practical Pat we shall henceforth call you. With the far-left candidate beating the other far-left (but anti-Islamification) candidate in France, it will be both pleasurable and painful to see the lights go out in the City of Lights. Libtards have no idea what ideology they’e letting run loose inside the gates. And if they do (and some surely do), that might be even worse.

      Trump is a liberal on this topic. I would stop all Islamic immigration into this country on the basis that Islam is not a religion but a Nazi-like totalitarian ideology bent on our destruction. But I am in the vast minority on this issue.

    • Rosalys says:

      Yes! Eat bacon, pork chops and ham by the truck load – the country you save just may be your own!

      Karl Denninger has been on a paleo type diet for the past five years or so and he’s thinner and healthier than he’s been in decades.

      https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?singlepost=3289664

      • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

        I read something yesterday that said that salt was 0ver-rated as a bad thing.

        Who has time to keep track of claim and counter-claim? I don’t. And all this in the context of many “homeopathic” and “non-GMO” claims that often seem to be pseudo-science.

        What we can know for sure is that much of these government and scientific discoveries or mandates are driven by political biases or agendas.

        • Rosalys says:

          Nothing “scientific” here – purely anecdotal – but as a confirmed salt-a-holic, my blood pressure is near perfect and always has been. About thirty years ago, there was a recall of a baby formula, causing severe physical or mental damage to babies because of a lack of sodium.

          My grandmother loved her salt, and she lived to be eight months shy of 100.

          Salt is a very necessary element to one’s health. It does not cause high blood pressure.

          Fat does not make you fat. Fat is a very necessary element to one’s health. Without fat, your body cannot metabolize your food and you will starve to death.

          One of my relatives “eats healthy,” takes all kinds of “natural supplements, and won’t touch anything unless it’s “organic.” She never looks or feels well.

          • Timothy Lane says:

            Salt increases water retention, which can increase blood pressure. But for most people it’s not a problem. The theoretical minimum daily requirement is 2300 mg. Those like me who have to watch it are generally advised to make that the approximate daily goal.

            • Rosalys says:

              True. Some people must avoid or cut down on salt for medical reasons. It’s the one size fits all label that bothers me.

              There are food Nazis all over, and anything can be taken to an extreme. I’ve even heard of one person who was so-o-o-o vegan that they fed their cat a vegan diet. That’s not good for a carnivore. And vegans have to be very careful to get a balance of amino acids.

              Our daughter dated a vegetarian once. His mainstay were carrots. He had a particularly pallid complexion (and personality.)

              • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

                How many vegans does it take to change a lightbulb?
                Two, one to change it and one to check for animal ingredients.

                (rimshot)

                Why does vegan cheese taste bad?
                It hasn’t been tested on mice.

                (rimshot)

                Linda: Do you know what veganism is?
                Jeff: No, tell me.
                Linda: It means no eggs and no milk!
                Jeff: Hmm, but how do you bread your steak?

                (rimshot)

                A guy has celery sticking out of one ear, lettuce out of the other, and a zucchini up his nose.
                He goes to the doctor and asks him what’s wrong.
                The doctor tells him, “Well, for one thing, you’re not eating right.”

                (rimshot)

                I follow a strict vegan diet. I eat only vegans.

                (rimshot)

                Two chums were talking at a ballgame and one offered to buy the other a hotdog.
                “No thanks,” came the answer. “I’m a vegetarian. I mean, I’ll eat a little white meat, but…”
                “Oh, I understand. Hey, I’m no cannibal. I mean, I’ll eat a few white people, but…”

                (rimshot)

              • pst4usa says:

                I am a vegan! I only eat things that are vegetables, or that eat vegetables, or that eat things that eat vegetables. That makes me a vegan, right?
                I feel so healthy, and so superior to the rest of you non vegans.

              • Timothy Lane says:

                As a friend says, “Vegetables aren’t food. Vegetables are what food eats.”

                My favorite light-bub joke are two I came up with. The first: How many programmers does it take to change a light-bulb? A’ That’s a hardware problem.

                The second: How many Clintons does it take to change a light-bulb? A: Three. One to make a public announcement of the change, one to stonewall Congress, one to hide all the documents, and one to lie about it.

              • Rosalys says:

                Hey, that’s four! (in regards to the second) Or was that part of the joke?

              • Timothy Lane says:

                That’s why the fourth was “to lie about it”. Note, too, that nobody actually changes the light-bulb.

          • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

            Rosalys, my biases clearly run in your direction. I’ve long rolled my eyes at “natural” products and “organic” foods. There is healthy and unhealthy, and all the shades in between. And what is good for one person might not be good for another.

            I reduce salt in my cooking merely because it overwhelms the taste of the food. This has long been the practice particularly in commercial soups. At times I tend to under-salt and have to put a bit back in. But it’s easier to add than to remove. And it’s better to have good ingredients rather than to try to hide mediocre ones with vast amounts of salt…which basically describes much of America’s diet. It isn’t salt, per se, that may be the problem but vulgar tastes.

            I think minimizing fat content is probably a good thing as well, particularly beef fat. Many of our food habits are cultural (particularly passed down to us from our parents) and just individual. I threw up one time as a kid after eating tomato soup and can’t touch the stuff now. But I love tomatoes in everything else.

            Arsenic is a natural product. And, in all likelihood, minute traces of it are actually good for you. But there are plenty of “natural” products out there that can kill you or make you very sick, such as rhubarb leaves (or so I’m told…I’ve never actually eaten one).

            One of the problems we face is that science has been thoroughly politicized. Because Left wing kooks, flakes, and nuts don’t like us eating meat, they’re generally going to expound on the virtues of vegetarianism. But you receive far less nutrition from uncooked foods (meat or vegetables) and thus people can indeed starve themselves. Man is meant to eat meat and he is meant to cook his food.

            That said, what I believe is best is lots of vegetables, moderate amounts of meat (particularly beef), easy on the corn products, and go easy on the sugar. I can’t say that I always stick with it, but I think it’s what I ought to do.

            • Rosalys says:

              Yeah. It’s the carbs that will get you. That’s why they fatten up food animals with corn.

              I have an abhorrence for fat, that is the thick rind of fat on a piece of meat.

              But bacon fat? Yum!

            • Rosalys says:

              Unfortunately, I like wheat and corn products, and sugar.

              • Gibblet says:

                “Unfortunately, I like wheat and corn products, and sugar.”

                Sounds like three of the four horseman of the apocalypse to me. The missing one being, of course, famine.

              • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

                Don’t we all. The food companies are fattening us up like cattle. Hmmm…I wonder.

              • Timothy Lane says:

                In the original book, there were only soylent steaks, which (as the name indicates) were made from soybeans and lentils. It was also set around 2000, and thus as prediction was a very bad miss.

              • Rosalys says:

                A bad miss? Or was this a sinister plan to lull us into a false comfort by getting us beyond the date?

    • Timothy Lane says:

      I have long favored the use of pig’s blood to send jihadists to Shaitan. S. M. Stirling uses this approach in one of his novels.

  11. Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

    BACON!

    Hahah. I get you’re one of the healthiest eater here, Gibblet. I’ve seen the pain you go to to get good fish!

    Honest disagreements can arise about good nutrition. But one common theme is that people want to eat an unhealthy diet and then cherry-pick a few fetishes to fool themselves into thinking they are working hard at it. I know a relative who was on some kind of Atkins diet. They ate a lot of bacon because it was, after all, low in carbs.

    I ran across a reference to a book this morning titled How Not To Die. The not-very-comprehensive reviews I’ve read suggest this is not a fetish-friendly book.

    Apparently the author has a “daily dozen” list that includes “exercise, nuts and seeds, herbs and spices, berries.” One reviewer says the book cover the topic of salt, stating that one reason there’s so much salt in meats (particularly chicken) is that it’s a cheap way to add up to 20% of weight because of water retention in the meat.

    Apparently there’s a lot of diet advice in this book for avoiding or curing diabetes.

    I would say it’s probably a good thing to:

    1) Avoid being overweight
    2) Exercise
    3) Easy on the carbs
    4) Eat lots of veggies and nuts
    5) Don’t worry, be happy.

    And possibly the most important advice regarding being healthy, particularly as you get older, is to be careful where you walk. You can eat the best foods in the word but if you trip and hurt yourself, what good is that?

    And to come back to the topic at hand…perhaps an apple a day.

    • Kung Fu Zu Kung Fu Zu says:

      Amazing the reaction my “bacon in the Garden of Eden” has generated. It just goes to show you that Bacon is something people are passionate about.

      Unfortunately, too much pork fat contributes to gout, at least for me.

      I like your apple a day. Lately, I have restarted an old practice which was common when I was a child. I take a nice apple, Gala at the moment, cut it in half, core and de-stem it then spread on a heaping teaspoon of peanut butter. I am sure this must be good for my health. At least it tastes good and makes me happy. So that must be healthy.

      • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

        Sounds good to me, Mr. Kung.

        And I got some exercise last night — which is my apple a day…or every third or fourth day — although this morning, as usual, it doesn’t feel too healthy. The aches and pains and just generally feeling of excursion. But I was in a sort of shitty-mood funk yesterday. Perhaps diet-related (my mother’s birthday was the day before and that marion berry pie was sure good…could have just been The Mother Principal at work).

        But the time I came back from my bike ride I felt great. Tired, hurting a bit, but mentally in much better shape. And despite my renewed mental acuity I, of course, funked up the Final Jeopardy question (as did one other guy) and named Clarence Darrow instead of Scopes. Oh well. No money was lost, however.

        • Timothy Lane says:

          Well, Darrow was the most famous of the defense lawyers at the Scopes trial. Incidentally, the scene in Inherit the Wind in which Darrow complains about a judicial decision, Judge Raulston hopes he didn’t intend to imply misconduct, and Darrow replies, “Well, Your Honor has the right to hope” actually happened. So did the judge’s answer — a contempt of court charge.

          As for an apple a day, that’s one of your few recommended health tips I actually follow. Occasionally it might be grapes or a banana, but usually it’s an apple (preferably Granny Smith).

          • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

            Granny Smith is good. And should be good for an apple pie I kinda-sorta promised the old folks home for Mother’s Day.

  12. Gibblet says:

    “But one common theme is that people want to eat an unhealthy diet and then cherry-pick a few fetishes to fool themselves into thinking they are working hard at it”

    Did someone say, “bacon”? Actually I am a very healthy eater (mostly out of necessity). I tend to do the opposite of the statement above; I eat a very healthy diet so that the occasional Bacon Guacamole Burger at Hopjacks is an indulgence. My husband will even split the Burger and the accompanying deep-fried tator tots with me, along with a beer (very dark beer, please). That way we do not overspend or over eat!

    Because I rarely eat processed/packaged foods, I have to make sure to eat enough salt. If I start dreaming of potato chips (which I don’t eat), I know I need salt. If I dream about ice cream (which I’m allergic to), I’m usually thirsty. I’m not sure what my current bacon fetish is about, but I may have to pick up some Hamster Bacon at Costco if it continues (Hempler’s brand, or some name like that. I find “Hamster” Bacon more amusing and easier to remember.). I think I can thank KFZ for instigating my current obsession.

    • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

      I was pretty sure you were a closet health nut. Maybe not “nut” but at least hamsterable. I’m not sure what that means.

    • Timothy Lane says:

      Note that some potato chips (such as Lay’s Regular Kettle chips) are relatively low in sodium while still possessing adequate salty flavor. They have 3 times as much potassium as sodium.

  13. Gibblet says:

    “hamsterable”

    Tastes like chicken.

    When my twin nieces were young, I took them to the “Chipmunk Grill” for burgers. My husband and I would often banter with the chef when we went there to eat. So I walk in with my nieces and the chef greets us, and I ask him, “How many chipmunks are in a hamburger patty anyway?” And without skipping a beat, he says, “four and a half”. We ordered the burgers, but they ate only the fries. My nieces are in their early 20’s now and, come to think about it, they are both vegetarians.

    • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

      Good story. I have a niece who is a vegetarian, although she was never militant about it. Whether this is called a heightened sense of compassion for animals or the further girlificiation of society, I’m not sure. But I do think a lot of this is steeped deeply in atheism whereby the belief is that man is just another animal. Mankind is thus lowered and animals raised up. The same shtick with America. To be “equal” and to rectify the situation, one component has to be taken down a notch and the other raised.

      Surely there can be health reasons behind vegetarianism. But so too can it be little more than an ideological fad or fashion.

      • Kung Fu Zu Kung Fu Zu says:

        Surely there can be health reasons behind vegetarianism. But so too can it be little more than an ideological fad or fashion.

        You will note, the pepper was bred by those vegetarian Indians!

        http://www.foxnews.com/food-drink/2017/05/10/ghost-pepper-eating-world-record-shattered-by-competitive-eater.html

        You see, vegetarianism can be bad for you. But I wouldn’t mind it if PETA members stuck to such a diet.

        Frankly, he should have cooked those peppers with a little sugar and milk then dilute it with cayenne add some pork drippings and then stir in corn starch as a thickener. It would add some zing to baby-back ribs or smoked pork chops.

        • Brad Nelson Brad Nelson says:

          Make a hell of a paint remover as well.

        • Rosalys says:

          Every year I like to have at least one hot pepper plant in my garden. I don’t use them much – I will make one or two pots of chili, but mostly give them away. I grow them more for their ornamental value as they are usually very lovely plants. One year I chanced upon a particularly beautiful plant. It had dozens and dozens of little golden colored fruit on it. It was also extre-e-e-emly hot. I gave a bunch to a guy I worked with, of Latin heritage, with a warning; but he boasted there wasn’t a pepper too hot for him! The next day he came in with a salad for his lunch, on which he sliced up a few of these peppers. As I was working at my computer, I heard him in the next room as he began eating his lunch. First a soft, “Oh.” Then a little louder, “Ah!” Next thing I knew he was running to the sink in the bathroom for water, practically screaming, “A-A-A-H-H-H!!!!”

          I tried not to laugh too loudly, as that would have been cruel.

    • Timothy Lane says:

      The Bob Rivers Comedy Group did a Christmas novelty CD, Chipmunks Roasting on an Open Fire, which has a pair of songs on the subject — the Chipmunks fooling around with “The Christmas Song”, and the title song in response. In addition, Rush Limbaugh once had a joke ad for a family cookbook, (probably) Rush singing “Chipmunks roasting on an open fire” in the background.

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